UK 10 Pence new variety?

Hi users of Numista
I'm been busy for the last few days sorting my collection and using the microscope to see if I mislabelled coin years or varieties I may have missed when I added the coin in the past. But I might have stumbled upon something when I was going through the 10 Pence pieces in my collection. For the 1998-2008 10 pence there is no listed varieties (as I know of) on the page. But when I was going through the 1992-1997 10ps and identifying which 1992 10p I had belongs to which variety, just out of curiosity I did the same for all other 10ps until I saw this on the 2006-2007 10p. But because I don't yet own a 2008 lion 10p I unable to see if its the same as the 2006-07 ones or not.

On the 1998-2005 10p (2004 & 2005 pictured) has the 1 pointing to the right of a bead. I also put lines as a guide to show it more clearly.
2004:

2005: Same as 2004 1 pointing to the right of a bead.

While for both 2006 10p that I own pictured below its the 1 pointing between beads:


2007 Same as the previous year 1 in 10 pointing in-between beads:


I this a new variety? or do I need new glasses.
Thanks

Citeer: "Worldwide collection"​I this a new variety? or do I need new glasses.
​Thanks
​

You have shown a difference between 2004-2005 and 2006-2007 but unless you can find a 2006-2007 with different bead location it's not a new variety (as in new year lines). Right now it's just a difference between years. Maybe you or another member with these coins can find a different 2006-2007.

Citeer: "rsirian1"​

Citeer: "Worldwide collection"​​I this a new variety? or do I need new glasses.
​​Thanks
​​
​
​

​You have shown a difference between 2004-2005 and 2006-2007 but unless you can find a 2006-2007 with different bead location it's not a new variety (as in new year lines). Right now it's just a difference between years. Maybe you or another member with these coins can find a different 2006-2007.

​I’ll probably wait until other members come forward with 2006-2008 10ps with the 1 pointed at a bead like the 1998-2005 ones. While that happens I might browse listings online for those particular coins or attempt to hunt for the other variety if it exists.

Other members will not do your research. What you've found so far is only type varieties, but I think you want to find a year variety, is that it?

Type variants are extremely common, year varieties are another matter (except for India). Good luck in your research in the fascinating world of year varities. A lot of time can be spend on that, I've heard

Take care

PS of course it would be easier to send as files via email!

Here are some 10P images sent to my years ago by Steve Leach (variant hunter and a member of numista). I've p^lenty of 5P images from him as well, if you want?

Mr. Paul Baker send the information of the 2005 variant to this site
http://www.coins-of-the-uk.co.uk/dec10.html
in 2006.
Later he detected that the 2006 coin had the same varieties as the 2005.
He sent that to me yesterday night after having seen this thread and asked if I could document the findings. Here it is



If you study the site given above you'll see, that 1992 coins also have two variants, which I'll try to document today.

Here is a variety I documented a long time ago and it's going to be the base of the 1992 documentation I just talked about....



It seems to cover everything (plus the width of the edges and the rim's profile)

Here is a variety I documented a long time ago and it's going to be the base of the 1992 documentation I just talked about....



It seems to cover everything (plus the width of the edges and the rim's profile)

Here is the new version

Citeer: "Sjoelund"​Mr. Paul Baker send the information of the 2005 variant to this site
​http://www.coins-of-the-uk.co.uk/dec10.html
​in 2006.
​Later he detected that the 2006 coin had the same varieties as the 2005.
​He sent that to me yesterday night after having seen this thread and asked if I could document the findings. Here it is
​
​
​
​If you study the site given above you'll see, that 1992 coins also have two variants, which I'll try to document today.
​

Thanks Paul and Sjoelund for documenting these findings.By some weird coincidence I was on the same site reading about the varieties.

Anyway I’ll be busy looking through my decimal U.K. coins again to see if there is anything worth mentioning and finally getting to my world coins in which I would report my findings if I find any.

Citeer: "Sjoelund"​Here is a variety I documented a long time ago and it's going to be the base of the 1992 documentation I just talked about....
​
​
​
​It seems to cover everything (plus the width of the edges and the rim's profile)
​
​Here is the new version
​
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Thanks for updating the documentation of the variants. Yesterday I was busy sorting my 92s that I hoarded using the website linked above and the variants document which in my opinion did required a bit a updating.

Just so you know, what already exists.

and here another one



I'm not sure if it's really a variety or just a mint error?

After monitoring the 1998-08 10ps that have gone through my hands I doubt there is a variety for the 07 and 08 but hopefully if luck is on my side I can document it.

After a year of looking for the varieties on the 2006 10p between the positioning of the beads, I have found two examples.

First coin is the 1 pointing to the right of a bead, while the second one is the 1 pointing between beads.

I can summarise the 1992-2008 ten pences for you.

 

As you know, there are two edge types for the 1992 small ten pences. The ‘wire’ edge and the ‘flat’ edge. The wire edge came first, the flat edge came second. There are many ways you will see these coins listed on various websites e.g. Type 1 obv./Type B rev. Seems there's not a standard referencing convention and it's a pain having to keep looking up which is which, so I prefer to simplify it as follows (much clear and easier to remember):

 

1992

 

Type - Edge type: Obv L,I points…/Rev. 1 in 10 points…

 

Type 1 - Wire edge: Between/At (Extremely Common)

Type 2 - Flat edge: Between/At (Extremely Common)

Type 3 - Flat edge: At/Between (Very Common & this is the type in the Proof & BU mint sets)

Type 4 - Flat edge: Between/Between (Scarce)

Type 5 - Flat edge: At/At (Scarcer)

 

 

1993-2008

These coins come with two reverse types; At or Between (as above). The type in the Proof/BU mint sets are always Between types. The circulation issues started out as always At types, but this changes from 2005 - more on that later. As the 'At' types were always a full release into circulation there are plenty of them comparative to the Between types, BUT they will all be circulated, usually very heavily. Uncirculated ‘At’ types are pretty scarce to outright rare. The general issue is:

 

1993 Type B (BU mint sets only)

1994 Type B (BU mint sets only)

1995 Type A (Circulation only)

1995 Type B (BU mint sets only)

1996 Type A (Circulation only)

1996 Type B (BU mint sets only)

1997 Type A (Circulation only)

1997 Type B (BU mint sets only)

1998 Type B (BU mint sets only)

1999 Type B (BU mint sets only)

2000 Type A (Circulation only)

2000 Type B (BU mint sets only)

2001 Type A (Circulation only)

2001 Type B (BU mint sets only)

2002 Type A (Circulation only)

2002 Type B (BU mint sets only)

2003 Type A (Circulation only)

2003 Type B (BU mint sets only)

2004 Type A (Circulation only)

2004 Type B (BU mint sets only)

 

Then in 2005 there begins a change. The Between type becomes a circulation coin as well as the mint set/Proof type. Eventually, it replaces the At type completely. So for 2005 and 2006 we have:

 

2005 Type A (Circulation only)

2005 Type B (Circulation & BU mint sets)

2006 Type A (Circulation only) - Rare

2006 Type B (Circulation & BU mint sets)

 

The 2005 types are pretty similar, either reverse can turn up in change, approx 50/50 chance. The 2006 issue though is very different. The Between type is the vast majority. The At type is near impossible to find. I've seen 3 examples so far, having known about them since 2008! It's much rarer that the Type 5 1992 - for example I've found 12 of those, all pulled from change between 2006 and 2009, then I stopped looking for them.

 

From 2007 it then settles into this pattern:

 

2007 Type B (Circulation & BU mint sets)

2008 Type B (Circulation & BU mint sets)

 

I am not aware of any At types for these two dates, if they do exist, they haven't been discovered yet!

 

Hope this is of interest/use.

Please can someone update the pages accordingly to this research.

 

Thanks

The ordering of the 1992 ten pence issues I strongly believe follows the pattern of:

 

Type 1 -    1992 Wire Edge - 1/A  (This was categorically the first issue - I remember them being introduced in 1992 and the edge was the first thing I noticed about them. This is also evident with the 5p coins from 1990-1991 having wire rims too, they also changed to a flat edge around 1992).

 

Type 2 -    1992 Flat Edge - 1/A  (The edge was amended to a flat edge - the obverse and reverse remain unchanged).

 

 

skip a few…

 

 

Type 5 -     1992 Flat Edge - 2/A  (I believe this was the final type of 10 pence issued in 1992 - the obverse and reverse are both ‘At’ dots type - exactly like the 1995-97 issues - It would be logical to think this was the natural progression to this type, which became the standard Maklouf type for the remainder of the design's run). I suspect these may have been minted into 1993. The old larger ten pence and florins remained in circulation right up until 30 June 1993, a lengthy transition - probably extra coins minted as demand dictated? Certainly the Type 5 has the lowest mintage of the 1992 series - suggesting a tail end to the run.

 

As to the middle two types, I am uncertain which came first. I tend to favour them in the order below:

 

Type 3  -    1992 Flat Edge - 2/B (This was the third highest mintage type after Types 1 & 2 - whereas Type 5 was the lowest mintage - It could be argued that the mintage dwindled progressively as the types went on - influenced by demand - and the speed at which they could withdraw the florins/large 10p pieces - consider it took 9 months to transition from the large 10p to the small, and yet the 5p switch only took 6 months). This Type 3 was also the type issued in all of the mint sets, which would have been on sale during 1992. The new ten pence was introduced in September that year. I'm not sure when the mint sets would have been completed, presumably before this date? Which means the Type 1 & 2 were minted in the run up to 1992, most likely in 1991, early 1992 and then the Type 3 soon after - Which is exactly what happened in 2016/7 when minting a stockpile of the new twelve sided £1 coins - not released until later in 2017. Same thing occured with the 1971 bronze coins, minting started as early as 1968 - and sold as such in presentation folders in 1968, prior to being introduced as currency in Feb 1971. Stockpile built up and mint sets sold before general release. It seems to be the established pattern, no reason to think it would be different here.

 

Type 4  -    1992 Flat Edge - 1/B (This was the second lowest 1992 mintage and possibly an additional run of coins as required? - It could be argued however that the Type 1 obverse was used up first and then the Type 2 introduced, thus putting this ahead of the Type 3 (2/B) issue, this seems logical, but this would then mean these Type 4's would have to be minted early in 1992 at the latest and were then followed by a much larger mintage of yet more 1992's - the aforementioned Type 3s; including those which were used for the proof/mint sets - which seems unlikely. Surely the largest runs would be completed first to ensure enough coins were available for the initial transition? I suspect therefore this Type 4 was an additional run - after Type 3, using up whatever dies were still serviceable or unused at this time. Then the Type 5 followed as another smaller batch to top up further - probably minted into 1993 and setting up the die types for the subsequent years.

 

Any thoughts?

Thanks SidS for explaining and listing the varieties found on these 10ps and yes the list must be updated to include the mentioned varieties and maybe at the bottom list the help of other users do the missing varieties from your list. 

 

When the list is being updated we can upload our pictures showing the visual examples of each variety for easy identification. 

So it's basically a further documentation to this already existing graphic?

That's really clear and well presented.

 

The info I presented was not to replace such a good visual representation, but merely to answer the question that was asked specifically about 2006 varieties.

 

I also thought it important to draw attention to the fact there were two varieties available for most dates from 1995-2006, and that it would be useful to be able to distinguish which version a collector had on the catalogue. Especially, since the 2006 A type is actually very scarce, possibly even rare. They are so seldom seen.

 

The 1992 wire rim types are also the first type issued for certain and every database/catalogue has them listed in the wrong order (as coming second). Except for the Tony Clayton website, which orders them correctly.

Thanks SidS for explaining and listing the varieties found on these 10ps and yes the list must be updated to include the mentioned varieties and maybe at the bottom list the help of other users do the missing varieties from your list. 

 

When the list is being updated we can upload our pictures showing the visual examples of each variety for easy identification.