Which of the two years on the French token is correct - 1749 or 1772? [opgelost]

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The question is a little strange, but when adding an article, I had a debate with the Numista referee about what year should be put on this token.


In the catalog Feuardent, Jetons Et Méreaux, a series of tokens from 3261 to 3267 are located one after another with the same date in exergue on the reverse - 1749, but different dates on the obverse -  from 1747 to 1789.

In various sources on the Internet, these tokens are displayed either with the date 1749, or with the date of the obverse. I found information about the ‘Commissaires du Chatelet’ that each of them led the commissariat for a certain amount of time. And I had a hypothesis that the tokens could have been issued in 1749 with the dates of administration of each of the series of commissioners in the future.

 

Please help us with the Numista referee to figure out which date is more correct to create an issue on Numista.

mln

hello token from 1772, 1749 was the date this person was commissioner

 

https://www.cgb.fr/police-et-gendarmerie-commissaires-du-chatelet-girard-doyen-sup,fjt_320111,a.html

Hello! Thank you for answer, but what about these tokens? They all have the same reverse with a date 1749:

1. Commisaire MR.DAMINOIS. 1747
https://www.inumis.com/shop/paris-commissaires-du-chatelet-daminois-1749-paris-1203961/

2. Commisaire MR. HVBERT. 1759
https://www.cgb.fr/police-et-gendarmerie-monsieur-hubert-ttb-,fjt_010077,a.html

 

3. Commisaire M. MOVRICAVLT. 1779

https://www.ma-shops.com/merson/item.php?id=22488

4. Commisaire M.CHENON. 1789

https://www.cgbfr.es/ile-de-france-villes-et-noblesse-pierre-chenon-commissaire-au-chatelet-refrappe-xixe-sup,fjt_261082,a.html

mln

here is a link that explains "commissaire du Chatelet" it is in French, with Google translation you can have it in English

 

 

https://sites.google.com/site/jetondepolice/home/les-commissaires-au-chatelet

Thanks a lot for the link! Do I understand it right, that for some reason there was only two types of reverses with the dates 1723 and 1749, and the real date of minting was on the obverse for each dean of the commissariat?

hareluca

1. Commisaire MR.DAMINOIS. 1747
https://www.inumis.com/shop/paris-commissaires-du-chatelet-daminois-1749-paris-1203961/

Mr. Daminois was “doyen” end of 1747 (or 1748) so his token might have been issued on 1749 instead of 1747

Otherwise, it would still be weird to see the actual issuing date before the frozen date 1749 🙃

Referee of south atlantic islands
Topic verplaatst naar "Exonumia information and questions" (ZacUK, 19-dec-2022, 18:37)

Frenchlover

hareluca

1. Commisaire MR.DAMINOIS. 1747
https://www.inumis.com/shop/paris-commissaires-du-chatelet-daminois-1749-paris-1203961/

Mr. Daminois was “doyen” end of 1747 (or 1748) so his token might have been issued on 1749 instead of 1747

Otherwise, it would still be weird to see the actual issuing date before the frozen date 1749 🙃

It seems to me I found an answer with a great help of mln via direct messages. The first year of issue of this series of tokens was 1723. It was the year of dean DELAMARRE or DELAMARE Nicolas (author of the famous police treatise). Then there were tokens with the same reverses of the deans: 

GALLYOT Pierre, dean from 1726 to 1737
SOUCY Jean-Baptiste (de), dean from 1738 to 1739

MENYER Nicolas, François, dean from 1740 to 1747

And the last dean who used this reverse was DAMINOIS Louis-Jérôme, dean from 1748 to 1759

 

But in 1749, as said me mln, there was the famous law which was created against vagabonds and beggars (https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b86186182.image). It could be a reason for this date to be commemorated on the reverse of the tokens. That's why dean  DAMINOIS Louis-Jérôme has two types of tokens: with a date 1723 and later - 1749.

 

Since DAMINOIS there was a new obverse of the tokens till the last dean CHENON Pierre, from 1790 to 1791

Status gewijzigd naar Opgelost (hareluca, 19-dec-2022, 19:44)

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